Speaker 0 | 00:05.501

All right, welcome everybody to Technology with a Beard extravaganza. Today we have another great guest with us, Mr. Shawn Klein. Shawn, I’ll let you introduce yourself and as always let’s start off with a, you know, some sort of mind-blowing story that you got for us.

Speaker 1 | 00:23.168

Sure, no, thank you so much for having me. It’s a pleasure. So I’m Shawn Klein. I’m president and CEO of TurboTek. We’re a managed services provider out of Manchester, New Hampshire. And my story is, it’s actually from a colleague of mine in Texas. As part of what I do, I go to conferences periodically. And this one I thought was quite inspirational. This fellow came from Africa. And I think he, I don’t remember, and I might get some of the details wrong, but I think the gist of it will come through. I don’t know if he met his wife in Africa and they came together or met her in Texas. But… They were active in their church. He’s in this business, you know, so they kind of grew their IT services business and managed services business over time. But as he was doing that, he went on a mission with his church to Africa and observed a water shortage leading to violence between tribes. And again, if I’m getting this story correct, I hope I am. But the idea will come through. You know, I think there was one group that was kind of agrarian, one that was more. hunter and they ended up essentially fighting over water and it was very violent it was a real problem and so as part of this mission they ended up creating a well and irrigation and really with very low investment made a huge impact on this group of people and and by the way just generally water shortage is one of the biggest solvable problems in the world and so you know he really picked a good one to work on but getting it back to it and so now you know, what he does is he diverts 10% of his profits to water projects around the world. And I don’t know if it’s just Africa anymore. But I thought it was just really inspirational that he was using this platform for doing good. So that was that was the story I heard.

Speaker 0 | 02:24.074

You’ve got sounds like a polycom in the background, ringing. Yeah, sorry about that. Let me put that on. No,

Speaker 1 | 02:31.541

is it a

Speaker 0 | 02:33.841

Polycom though? It is. You know, I just got to point that out, you know, being a Telecom guy, I can tell the phone ring in the background. That’s good. No, it’s a great story. I mean, because it’s the type of thing where, you know, you build a well. I remember my, you know, my family, we did, it was the same thing, water shortage in India. And a well is something that… you know, once you build it, it keeps giving, you know, it’s not like, uh, it’s not like you gave, you know, like a few hundred dollars here and you felt good about yourself for making a donation, which I’m not, you know, I’m not putting down in any, in any way. I’m just saying when you dig a well, you’re providing yes, clean water for, you know, a whole village or a whole group of people. Um, and it is something that, um, Like you said, it’s a problem that can be solved, whether it be water filtration. There’s a lot of different water filtration devices and inventions and then just digging a well as well, which is surprising that you can just go dig a well and solve a problem.

Speaker 1 | 03:37.631

Well, yeah, and I love the fact that he built it into the structure of his business. And, you know, now he’ll talk with customers and prospects about it. He puts it in the newsletter and everyone gets excited about it. And so, you know, it’s all about vision, because if we’re just IT services providers. kind of doing the bare minimum and just getting by, we can’t afford to do these things, whether it’s for our customers in the right way, which we’ll talk about throughout this discussion, or it’s outside our company. So I thought it was a really good kind of indicator of how to run a business in a way that’s good for everyone.

Speaker 0 | 04:12.346

Yeah, well, yeah, why are we here to begin with? And I you know, this is the famous 80-20 rule is, you know, 80% of my industry, at least the telecom industry, and probably a lot of people have a problem with this, but I don’t have a problem saying it at all. 80% of the people are not in it for the right reasons or they’re in it for fairly selfish reasons. And you can see that based on, you can just see it at events. You can see it at events all day long. So what are we doing? Why are we here? Which, you know, to segue into the next topic, we had a great discussion last week, and this was right before. before you decided that you could choke me out and rip my arm off. Which was, I gotta throw that in there because. I think IT and jujitsu should go hand in hand. I did a podcast months back with Jeremiah Grossman, who had hacked into Yahoo as well. He’s actually a black belt in jujitsu. And hopefully he’s actually going to come here someday and roll with us hopefully this year. So you’ll be invited to have him rip off your arm as well.

Speaker 1 | 05:17.787

Thank you.

Speaker 0 | 05:18.428

So I’ll invite you to that. But we had a great conversation about the cost of a ticket, right? So a lot of times people think… I need to hire a help desk person or I need and I’m talking not from uh talking from the CEO’s perspective I need to hire an IT guy we need to take care of these tickets or we need a ticketing system and I have IT guys hey what do you use for your ticketing system it’s all about tickets and I don’t want to we shouldn’t be professional ticket takers I hate taking tickets I hate when people tell me what’s the ticket number please enter a ticket but so what is the cost though we talked about the cost of a ticket and just that whole The idea around that itself, you have a very special, I would say, almost, you know, your special sauce, your proprietary approach to it. Tell me, just talk a little bit about the cost of a ticket and how you address and how you would approach a small or medium sized business that needs IT help.

Speaker 1 | 06:18.276

Yeah. And, you know, the first question I have to ask in response to that, well, what’s the cost or value of an employee? And, you know, that’s the thing that. that people don’t usually think about. And, and frankly, on both sides of it, whether it’s the IT services company or the end customer, they think about, okay, I’ve got to pay my vendor a certain amount of money, you know, to solve these tickets. And as an engineer working on the tickets, they think, okay, the ticket comes in and then it goes out and that’s my job. And, you know, I’ve spent years and we’re 30 years old as a company. acquired it nine years ago. And I’ve been working on this for years, sort of changing the culture of the company in addition to thinking about this question you’re asking. And so, you know, there’s two sides of the cost. There is the cost you pay your vendor, whether you have some type of service contract or whether it’s a break fix. But then there’s the cost on the other side of the employee. And that’s typically much more. And then you get into the question of, well, what is the ticket? You know, I can have two different. tickets, both on the same issue. A printer is down. And one could be for a receptionist who can walk across the hall and print out whatever she needs to do over there. And the other printer could be in the CFO’s office, and he’s printing out checks for mission-critical vendors. That’s the exact same technical problem. And if someone just approaches it as, well, you know, printer’s down, let’s fix the printer. or the phone’s down, let’s fix the phone. And they don’t think about the business impact of that ticket. And they don’t think about, well, what’s the cost of the employee on the other side of that? What’s the value of the employee on the other side of that? Then they’re really missing out on the bigger picture and the bigger vision of what we’re trying to do. So I think triage is hugely important. But whenever I ask that question to a prospect, and I’ll talk about this, I’ll say, there’s usually a range. On one end of the spectrum, people say, I don’t care if my employees have to work harder, work later or whatever. They’re on the payroll and they’re quote unquote free. On the other end of the spectrum, you know, people say, wow, you know, there’s real money there. You know, you got a 40 person company. Maybe you have $400,000 in expenses every month. So what’s the cost of that ticket? It’s impacting those expenses in some way.

Speaker 0 | 08:47.472

So let’s go through maybe like. Let’s go through an example. Do you have a, you know, maybe one or two or just one great example that you can think of where from a business perspective thinking IT department, not someone that just comes in and yeah, we’ll take care of the tickets. We will fix broken. We’ll take a break-fix approach. We’ll give you a bucket of hours, however it is. I have this saying where it’s, why am I paying my IT company when nothing’s going wrong? Sure. What am I paying you for? Right. So can you give me an example of where you came in, eliminated ticketing issues, and how did that affect the bottom line?

Speaker 1 | 09:42.405

Sure. Yeah, so I had a customer, their name was Lawn Dog, and I said had because they recently were acquired by True Green, which is a multi-billion dollar company, so they have their own IT, so we don’t work with them anymore. But we have been working with them for years, and when I first got to know them, they were working with what I would describe as a reactive IT services provider. And they had about 60 different tickets across their 60 employees at the time we were working with. And, you know, these were tickets that were lingering on for, you know, a long time, weeks in certain cases. And this company had a real unique competitive advantage in their sales and customer support and marketing and all of that. In that, for example, they had this ability to do what they call one-touch close. Many lawn care… providers that was their vertical would have to actually go out to the properties to determine what’s the size and what’s needed and so it was a longer sales process what Blondog had was technology so they were very technology dependent and they were all in the cloud by the way to be able to assess the property determine it and in one call be able to close that and so that was great Their business grew and they were very successful, ended up having a successful exit for them and their investors, good customer service, everything’s wonderful. The double-edged side of that sword is highly reliant on technology to do that. And so the president of the company once told me that if they’re done for an hour in their busy season, they lose 70 customers because they did do business-to-business work, but a lot of consumer work as well. So using our process, we got them from 60. tickets outstanding down to zero at one point. Now that’s not natural. You’re going to have some level of organic kind of issues that go on and certainly we did, but order of magnitude difference. And so how do you assess the value of it? It’s hard to say, but when you’ve got salespeople who can’t close business, you lose those 70 customers potentially, what’s the lifetime value of those customers you’ve got? cross-selling that you can do. You got people in the field with tablets who are trying to do things and print out their reports. And, you know, so pretty big value. So you’re talking, you know, hundreds of thousands of dollars, I’m sure, you know, so big, big value.

Speaker 0 | 12:18.329

Absolutely. Well, I can tell you right now, I don’t know about the lawn, you know, the lawn industry, how fast someone picks up the phone and call someone else when they can’t get through. But I know in the real estate, I know in real estate, for example, it’s I mean, it’s literally seconds from the time that someone types in their information on Zillow, for example, that they’re interested in a house. If an agent does not call that person back in less than 60 seconds, I mean, their interest level is done. They are on to something else. They’re in their other app already, whatever it is. But if they actually take the time to type in their phone number and email into an application and. that someone doesn’t call them back immediately, that lead’s gone. Absolutely. Because there’s a thousand real estate agents on every street corner, and that’s not to say that they don’t differentiate each other from each other. They do. But from a technology’s perspective, if they type their information in, that info immediately goes into an automatic dialer that’s either hosted five, nine, with an API into RingCentral, whatever it is, and there is a real estate agent down the street calling that person immediately. Great. When that goes down, that is, I mean, all you got to do is lose one or two house sales and it’s paid for itself. So was there a way that you measured, so 60 tickets to near zero, those 60 tickets, did they come in over a week, a month? Do you remember at all kind of what some of those matrix were, where those tickets came in, like the period of time?

Speaker 1 | 13:48.383

Well, yeah, it’s a great question because what ends up happening is if you don’t have an engine in which you are, first of all, You have to have a low volume of tickets in order for this even to work. Because if you don’t have a low volume of tickets, you’re constantly running around and your backlog grows and grows. So you have to be able to respond quickly to tickets. You have to be able to close tickets quickly. And the entire organization needs to drive down tickets. They can’t be thinking about just their role. They all have to be saying. Tickets are the fundamental things which weigh down our customers and which impact them. So we all have to do that. So I think that those 60 tickets, you know, probably came over many, many months. Because what would happen if you’d have something going on and if you don’t have a culture of looking at aging on a daily and weekly basis and saying, OK, it’s not acceptable, then those just tend to grow. And I can tell you that because we have some customers who we call point of contact customers where they’ll have an in-house person who does the reactive support. And it’s fascinating to me to compare the metrics that we see with them versus ours. You know, ours, you would expect to be world class, which they are. But our customer points of contact, they aren’t. And we have to educate them and we have to work with them and say, hey, look, we can’t have a ticket that ages for 13 days.

Speaker 0 | 15:17.138

We just can’t do it. Let me just jump in there real quick. Now, do you think that’s just due to employee burnout or the fact that someone’s sitting on payroll? I don’t want to assume anything. I mean, why do you or do you think they just don’t have the same tools that you guys have because you’ve been doing it for 30 years and you’ve seen every type of business? there is out there, why would in-house IT react slower?

Speaker 1 | 15:41.365

Well, it’s like inventory. So when you have a lot of inventory in your business, it hides a lot of rocks underneath the surface, because all of a sudden you can say someone orders something and you’ve got all this inventory and just ship it out, right? But it’s really, really expensive. And so you essentially have an inventory of a reactive service person. which is probably excessive. And you probably have more bandwidth than you need if you’re world-class. And then on the executive side of the house, they don’t want to deal with the problem. Most executives I talk to, they don’t want to even think about it. You know, they want to run their business. And so it’s an education process to say, okay, I hear you on that, but let’s look at what are the costs and results you’re getting from your process. Let’s compare that with what it could be. Now the question is, do you want to make a change? You know, whether it’s with me or someone else, you know, do you want to make a change? Is this important enough for you? And it’s not important enough for a lot of people, but I think it’s usually because they’re not really examining it and they don’t have a process. And then in terms of the employee, I don’t think these employees are, you know, sort of irresponsible, but when you don’t measure something, you can’t improve it. And in most cases, these employees are not measuring themselves. They have no incentive to. and they’re not being measured. And so that’s my feeling. I think it’s an issue of inappropriate incentives and oversight and culture to deliver these results.

Speaker 0 | 17:16.034

I love that. It’s a numbers game. Everything is a numbers game, and it takes the emotion out of everything. When you start measuring it and you start tracking results, you can only get better on those. You can only drive against those results.

Speaker 1 | 17:28.967

That’s an excellent point. And by the way, you know, I had to go through a cultural change in my company where people used to say, oh, here are Sean’s metrics. I’m like, no, these aren’t my metrics. These are your metrics. And why are we doing this in the first place? You know, we got to think about the customer on the other end of that. You know, there’s a person on the other end of that ticket who’s trying to do something. And, you know, we work with all sorts of people from medical to manufacturing, all of that. And, you know, I don’t exaggerate when I say, look, lives are on the line sometimes, you know. And so we really have to think about that when we’re in this business.

Speaker 0 | 18:08.335

Yeah, and this is nothing new either. Every great business owner, and we’re talking technology here also, has measured results. I mean, that’s old school how to win friends and influence people where whatever it was, they wrote like a big number on the floor of the warehouse, which represented. you know whatever how many employees were served or whatever the time was i can’t remember i read it so long ago but everyone would come in and look at the number like what’s that exactly and then it was about how do we improve on that number so let’s talk a little bit more you’d you know we had also talked about um tickets to cost time to fix employee time to yes to call in that ticket So there’s all these different, what would you say are the main, I guess, the metrics, if we were to graph this and put it into the play of the numbers game, what are some of those bullet points?

Speaker 1 | 19:10.547

Well, okay. And by the way, I hasten to add that a lot of the concepts I get are from others. So we’re executing against this, Gary Pica, Bob Penley.

Speaker 0 | 19:20.454

I’m okay with stealing famously, but go ahead and name some people. Well,

Speaker 1 | 19:23.135

I just want to credit people where it’s due. So these are concepts which I’ve learned over the years from other folks who’ve gone before me. But so we think about a couple of things. It used to be we would think about tickets per endpoint per month was a really critical one. And that’s something that most people don’t even think about. But that’s a direct measure of productivity. And then the one which is a little bit more refined is react. active hours per endpoint per month, because then you start to get to, well, how much time is my employee losing because of this? Now, to then value that and say, well, what’s the cost on my business? Usually only the executive can make that judgment. But one way to value it is to say, okay, you have a certain process today and it costs a certain amount. And I would say the majority of people underspend in this area. We know how to get you to a world-class level, and it’s going to cost you more, whether you do it with us or someone else. Because to do what I’m talking about takes process, it takes people, it takes tools, automation, it takes cultural change, all of that. And so that costs more. And the question is, is it worth it to your business to spend that extra $1,000, $2,000? And it’s not for everyone. I talk to businesses all the time where I’m like, you know. So what is it like when you have downtime here? And they say, no big deal. We just revert to paper.

Speaker 0 | 20:57.563

We go play nine holes of golf. I mean, dude, I got the golf gloves. I’m out. I go to YouTube.

Speaker 1 | 21:04.228

Exactly. There are absolutely people who take a lifestyle approach to it or take an old school approach to it, and I’m not criticizing them. I’m just saying I’d like you to know what your decision is. is in front of you and then to decide what do you want to do what are your goals for the business do you want to grow your business i mean i know for me i want to have the most amount of revenue with the fewest number of employees you know be profitable and not just for selfish gains but to be able to do good things like we talked about in the beginning for employees for vendors for partners for you know customers obviously you know so i think that everyone has a vision and a purpose like you have a vision and a purpose and honestly if you want to go out and play

Speaker 0 | 21:47.906

eight you want to play 18 holes of golf twice a week there’s a good chance that paying that extra money or technology is going to help you a make more money or be more productive and free up that time anyways we don’t need to wait for the phones to go down to do that now let’s not i and i don’t think we need to we definitely don’t need to get into fear mongering either but there’s it yes there’s time and process and there’s time to implement things but are there any quick wins Are there ways where you can come in and make an impact very quickly?

Speaker 1 | 22:20.179

I think so. I think the biggest area I see across my customer base and the people I talk to is in security. You know, if you go in and we think about getting predictive results as alignment to standards, and this is whether you’re talking about security or performance or uptime, you know, any of these things, we find there’s a direct correlation to that. And the vast majority of people are not compliant to the right level standards. And this is a tricky area because it’s not a one-shot deal. You don’t just go in and do a security audit and fix some things and walk away. Things move. Things change. And so it’s much more of a process. It’s much more of a flow. And I think that’s probably the biggest opportunity. I mean, I’ve talked to, I recently got a customer from one of my, who I thought was a really good competitor. But, um. They’re not as good as I thought. They didn’t really have a process. And in fact, this customer had crypto locker viruses twice. And I just talked to a prospect who also did. So this is happening. And people are getting more sophisticated. And again, I don’t, you know, I come from RSA. And we talked about security as being like brakes on a car. You know, why do you have brakes on your car, Phil? uh yeah to stop well that’s one way to look at it but the other way to look at it is to go as fast as you want to and that was sort of the repositioning that you know what i mean it’s a different approach right it’s the repositioning that rsa took with it because it used to be it was all about fear and uncertainty and doubt and all that kind of stuff but you know it’s not as useful i think to say okay where do i want to take my business and what risks do i want to take you know talk about companies where they have shut off internet access to outside people and they’ve literally shut down aspects of their network because they’re afraid yeah you can do that But, you know, is that the best outcome for your business? Is that the best service to your customers and to your salespeople and everyone who’s involved in that? And so I really try to take the philosophy of, yeah, we want to take the right amount of risks. It’s like in finance. You know, the stock market has risk, but risk is not a bad thing. Risk is a good thing. You just want to be intelligent in how you take your risks and you want to choose that in the right way. And so I think that’s probably one of the biggest impacts is we can come in. And using our process, we can really give an objective view as to where folks are on an ongoing basis. And then they can make the right business decisions as to which risks they want to take and how fast they want to go.

Speaker 0 | 25:04.227

Now, what about general infrastructure stuff? What about, like you said, they shut down access to the Internet. What about other just general equipment stuff, firewalls, endpoints, thin clients, Internet access? You know. your Polycom phone that’s ringing on your desk earlier? What about stuff like that? I mean,

Speaker 1 | 25:24.650

it’s all critical. I mean, you know, the way I think about it is I start from the business services side. So what are the key line of business applications? What are the key services, whether that’s, you know, telecom or web or whatever it is that are really critical to driving that business? Typically, there are certain things, if you think about it from a business process perspective of… how they’re getting customers, how they’re delighting customers, how they’re competing, all of that. There are systems. And then from there we go to, okay, well, what’s the infrastructure? What’s the plumbing that supports all of that? If we start from the plumbing side and we make that the important thing, you tend to make bad decisions. You tend to grow infrastructure in a way which doesn’t always make sense. But if we always ground it in, okay, what are we trying to achieve? then all of these things become critical. And this idea of standards applies across them. And so we think it’s important to have standards in each of these areas. That doesn’t necessarily mean that we suggest forklift upgrades for everyone, because I think that you’ve got to be sensitive to the costs of all of this, and then that we can afford from there. But we’ve got to apply these standards and process to all of these things.

Speaker 0 | 26:44.677

Yeah. And for most people that know me know that there’s a couple ways I do business. One, I work with MSPs like yourself where we work together to take a look at utility costs, so internet, phone service. And it’s really inappropriate to even call it a utility. A lot of people get offended when we call it a utility because phone service is clearly an application. It’s an application now. It’s one more application on the list. And it’s very rare that I walk into a place and we’re not a saving them 20% just on their general cost and giving them and increasing them by 50 to 100%. So even though like you said, yes, you don’t start there. It’s the, you know, I like, you know, I like your approach. Let’s start with the application. Let’s start what we’re trying to accomplish. Let’s start with how those applications support the business. Now let’s take a look at the. the skeleton or the spinal cord of the business, which would be, you know, the network, right? But it still surprises me. I mean, it’s every day that I look at a place, I can honestly confidently say, like, there is something wrong with the situation because you are paying way too much money and you’re getting way too little. So to kind of tie all this together and yes, give credit where credit’s due, but we talked last time about, you know, the analogy of the grocery store versus the bakery and they’re still going to the grocery store i was at the grocery store last night i was at market basket and it was interesting because i was looking at their you know as they’re ringing things up and it just i i was like this thing must be running on dos 2.0 or i just can’t imagine it because you know it just looks like that’s where you see old computers and when are they going to upgrade you know every supermarket in america they’re just not going to do that anytime soon until you know the dinosaurs die off you But that analogy was fairly mind-altering. So maybe I’ll let you speak to that as the last point here.

Speaker 1 | 28:54.709

Yeah. So I think that you can approach this business of IT services in those two frameworks. And one is to say, I’m going to get the ingredients I need. So I’m going to purchase some point services, hours of time. I’m going to get some monitoring. I’m going to get some backup. I’m going to do some security. I’m going to get some reactive support. And then you kind of mix it all together, and that’s your IT support strategy. And imagine doing that, you know, imagine doing that in terms of baking, you know, you want to make some food for yourself, you want to bake a cake. And so the other spectrum is you go to a bakery, you know, you don’t go in there and scrutinize what type of flour they’re using necessarily. You know, maybe you have some specific needs, you want to be gluten free, that’s fine. But in the end of the day, you’re purchasing that end product. You want that end result. You want that chocolate. cake and it’s a combination of ingredients the ingredients are there but it’s much more the process around how they put that all together and the fact that they’re focusing on that end result and there are different costs there you know if you add up all the ingredients for a wonderful bakery chocolate cake it’s not that much probably if you pay for that chocolate cake it’s gonna be more because you’re paying for that end result. And so I think that’s the difference. And the problem is that, like I say, I think people don’t want to think about it. They don’t want to worry about it. This is low on their agenda. And I think the only way that it rises is either if they have pain or if you ask them some questions about pain that they have, but they didn’t know. You know, this area of security, without trying to make people too afraid. It’s important. And if you ask the right questions, you can kind of uncover what are really IT processes that are out of alignment. Because typically when I ask someone a question and they say, oh, yeah, we had a cryptolocker virus or we had some downtime or whatever, those are two questions. And if I ask 20 other ones, I’m going to get 14 answers, which are maybe not the best thing. No, it’s not for everyone. You know, we already described there are some businesses which they don’t care. But if it’s important and it drives the technology and you want to go on offense, you know, I think of strategy as offense and defense. A lot of what we’re talking about is defense. If you want to go on offense, then you really got to have a process which allows you to do that.

Speaker 0 | 31:34.530

Well, there definitely is a business side where you’ve got small business, you’ve got, you know, just on our enterprise side where you’ve got a team or you’ve got an IT department. And then there’s that kind of. in between. I’m bigger than a small business. I’m almost medium, but I don’t want to pay $140,000 a year for an IT guy. And they’re the ones questioning, why should I pay you? I don’t know, five, $6,000 a month. Well, number one, A, you’re getting a really good chocolate cake recipe. Number two, you’re paying half of what you would pay for a singular person. and you’re getting a whole team. So I think that’s kind of where I’m, you know, you tell me if I’m wrong, but I’m assuming that that’s, that’s the perfect fit for you. And that’s where you can make the biggest impact.

Speaker 1 | 32:27.788

Well, you know, so let me, let me break it down like this. I think there are sort of four ways that people can try to solve this problem. One is through in-house, which you alluded to. One is through break fix, which surprisingly still exists today. One is through what are so-called managed services providers. But there’s a class of managed services providers. Anyone can use this label. It’s like cloud, right? What does it mean? But they’re really reacting to tools. So they implement some tools that we talked about before, monitoring or security or whatever. And then they fundamentally react to those things. Or you can do it in the model that I’m talking about, which is an entire cultural company change where everyone in the organization, their whole thought is, how do I reduce ticket count? how do I reduce risk? And that’s a very different set of processes and tools and approaches. So I think even if you’re talking about salary costs of an in-house person, it kind of takes a village, right? Because if you have standards in 15 or 20 distinct technology areas, which even small businesses do, you know, think about security itself. You got five different distinct security things you already mentioned. firewall, there’s antivirus, anti-malware, anti-spam, there’s all these different things, right? And then you have servers and software and hardware and virtualization and networks and power and environmental, there are a lot of different areas. It is impossible for one person to be an expert in all those areas. It’s not their fault, but it’s just impossible. And so that’s why you need to have a set of people, domain experts in different areas who are sitting next to each other, collaborating and helping. The other big problem is that it’s… very, very difficult, if not impossible, to be proactive and reactive in the same person. And so, you know, if you’re trying to put together a strategy, you’re trying to get ahead of this, you know, you’ve got good intentions. And then someone says, oh, my monitor isn’t working, and you got to go walk down the hall and you got to go fix that. That takes time, you know, and if you have an in-house person, you know, they’re going to be working on tickets on an ongoing basis. Right. And so how are they going to, that’s what we call the reactive spiral of death. Can’t react. I know. Yes.

Speaker 0 | 34:43.423

I have the, now I have the name for the podcast for this title, the reactive spiral of death. Yeah. If people want to get ahold of you, what’s the best way to get ahold of you and your, you.

Speaker 1 | 34:55.769

primarily operate in the northeast or if you’d like to if you’d like to be specific about that you know please do I’m assuming you know New Hampshire kind of northern Massachusetts maybe southern Maine yeah yeah I try to stay within an hour of Manchester New Hampshire this is a high-touch model where my team is going on-site on a regular basis I like to meet with executives frequently you know at least quarterly so we try to stay reasonably close But yeah, no, my direct line is 603-296-4845. Feel free to reach out to me there. Or my email address is SeanK at TurboTechComputer.com. S-E-A-N-K at TurboTech. And TurboTech is spelled with a K. So T-U-R-B-O-T-E-K Computer.com. Awesome. Sean,

Speaker 0 | 35:48.075

thank you so much for being on the show today. I think this is… it’s going to be very beneficial for everyone across the country.

Speaker 1 | 35:57.504

Oh my pleasure.

Speaker 0 | 35:58.245

Appreciate it man. Yeah one final thought. If you had one final thought though, you know, what is it?

Speaker 1 | 36:04.270

Oh one final thought, that’s such a big question, you know, but I would say think about the end result, you know, what’s the end result you want and then work backwards from there.

Speaker 0 | 36:16.721

Awesome man, have a great day, thank you.

Speaker 1 | 36:18.583

All right you too.